Stupid Newbe Question

[Ldan65]

Just got platinum 5 and recorded some tracks in Pro Tools LE 8.04. When I try to use the plug in on the snare track it samples off of other tracks such as bass and overheads that are playing but don't have the plug in. If I mute the other tracks it is fine. Am I missing something?

Real simple layout, I have 8 drum inputs going to separate tracks, all outputing to channels 1&2.

Why would it trigger off of tracks that the plug in is not install on?

[Jack]

Hello,

There are certainly no stupid questions

The first thing to check is that you are using Drumagog as an insert on the track, and not on your stereo buss. Based on your description, it sounds like that bleed-through from the other drums are triggering Drumagog on the snare track. But it can't be the actual other tracks doing it, it has to be the bleed-through that was recorded on the snare mic. Muting the other drum tracks should have no effect, unless you are using Drumagog on a buss.

Trying raising the Sensitivity in the Visual Triggering Window, so that it stops triggering off the bleed. If some of the bleed is louder than the snare itself, you may need to investigate Drumagog's Trigger Filter to filter out some of the bleed.

[Ldan65]

OK narrowed it down to either latency or delay. When I drop other tracks in, especially the overheads, you hear what sounds like flams.

I recorded the sampled track by outputting to bus 1 and recording it on a new track from bus 1. You can clearly see a difference in the timing. The peaks do not line up.

Any suggestions?

[Ldan65]

Got it, default is advanced triggering. Switched to live and walla!

[Jack]

Hello,

The reason why you were hearing flams, is because Pro Tools 8 LE doesn't offer plugin delay compensation. So Drumagog's output were delayed 80 ms, compared to the rest of your tracks. Switching to live mode can help, because live mode has a much lower latency, but it isn't as accurate as advanced mode and will still be off 2-3 ms anyway. The thing most users do is keep it in advanced mode, bounce to a new track (like you did), and then "nudge" that track earlier in time (80 ms).

This is one reason people are looking forward to Pro Tools 9, as the LE version will now include delay compensation, making workarounds like this unnecessary.

[neilwilkes]

OK narrowed it down to either latency or delay. When I drop other tracks in, especially the overheads, you hear what sounds like flams.

I recorded the sampled track by outputting to bus 1 and recording it on a new track from bus 1. You can clearly see a difference in the timing. The peaks do not line up.

Any suggestions?

As well as the answer given by Jack above, you need to be very careful when using replaced close sounds in conjunction with the original sounds recorded in overheads, as you will need to adjust for the additional delay on the overheads.
Sound travels very slowly.
Roughly 1 foot per millisecond, in fact. Actually, that is not strictly true as the speed of sound varies according to altitude and air pressure, but 1ms/ft is close enough for our purposes.
This means that is your overhead mics were 5 feet away from the snare, your overheads have 5 ms of latency compared to the close mic on the snare, which can cause a strange effect.......

[Ldan65]

You are both right on. Once I READ the manual, I found out about the issues with LE. I also picked up on the issue with the overheads not lining up.

You both seem very knowledgeable, any avdice on getting a natural sound out of the snare ducking. I have a thick maple shell snare that cuts through everything! It seems like the ducking is causing the overal sound of the cymbals to be diminished.

Also, do any of you think it's worth the money at this time to upgrade to LE 9.0 Kinda seemed a little pricey.